Epic Kayaks - Rough Water Comparison

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Most popular comments
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PaddleDogC5 - 11 years ago

cherry picking boats and conditions

PaddleDogC5 - 7 years ago

no I have 5 composite kayaks with better quality than Epics made in China. Lets see it in short breaking chop when the deck buries in the water.

titleatty1 - 7 years ago

I keep finding negative posts by you -- always condemning the new high tech designs, especially from Epic. Are you still clinging to your poly SOT?

Dino Alberini - 11 years ago

I paddle a prijon bala with no rocker at all because it's a downriver kayak. It's fast as a bullet but very difficult to control in waves. I would trade some speed for a bit of handling i.e. a little rocker, however, when you manage to ride a wave, you're incredibly fast. And you roll easily.

Romany1111 - 11 years ago

Good comments, Ian. The Vs are fast boats, and I think it is a personal thing, as you said. Have wash-deck and cockpit and prefer the control and performance I get in the latter. Happen to like the air time In the pointy nosers. I use a lap belt as well in my WW boats when in surf...really increases "hang time" upside-down.

Romany1111 - 11 years ago

Thanks, Ian.

Ian Smith - 11 years ago

I can only quote my experience, and I do go and talk to the paddlers on the beach watching. They did not feel confident in joining us. I know there are good experienced paddlers who will go out in most conditions, but it is not the norm. where as majority of Surkski paddler search for and relish such conditions.

Ian Smith - 11 years ago

Personal choice I guess. I found the opposite. When the swell and surf is up the V8 is my go to boat. I use a lap belt so that I can roll and edge. Your comment re only good in a straight run does not apply the the shorter skis like the V8. We (being quite a few locally) have found that we perform in the rough stuff on the V8 and win races quite convincingly against similar length sea kayaks.

Romany1111 - 11 years ago

If your big conditions are so intimidating to sea kayakers, maybe the kayakers were not interested in joining you, not intimidated. Sounds like big man Oscar talking. The W Greenland-style British boats will wipe the skis out in lively play, all the way through storm conditions. The ski is fast in straight line, like a dragster. I prefer the Formula 1-quality handling of my NDKs, Valleys, and Rockpool kayaks any day to my V8.

Romany1111 - 11 years ago

I'll take the rockered boat any day. Barton's design is from his years as a flat-water racer. That's not ocean swell, surf, breaking followers, etc. Plowing through is fine if you are a farmer. I want the mobility and liveliness of the kayak in the foreground.

Ian Smith - 11 years ago

To be fair, they are comparing the 2 designs in the said conditions...no more than that. It is interesting how many kayak manufacturers are now producing similar designs to the Epic 18X. The ski version of this Epic hull has just convincingly won the Oban Sea Kayak Race which occurs the full range of conditions with wind, tide and waves from all directions.

10. comment for Epic Kayaks - Rough Water Comparison

Ian Smith - 11 years ago

To be fair the video is only comparing the 2 designs in the conditions shown and from my experience that is exactly what happens. The Oban Sea Kayak Race around an Island presents a fair presentation of a satiety of conditions...head wind and waves, cross wind and waves and following sea and wind. The Epic V8 (the 18' ski/kayak version of this hull) recently one that race comfortably.

Antonius Carbonius - 11 years ago

exactly, it is not professional to make comparison of two different types of boats...so not ALL paddling conditions, as stated in the video.

Antonius Carbonius - 11 years ago

the kayak that is chosen for comparison has very big rocker and is probably made for surfing....its not so bad you you present it. nice try!

Ian Smith - 11 years ago

Really??? Have a look at the conditions that the Surfski racers go out in. A group of us paddle the V8 in big winter conditions. The sea kayaks are lined up on the beach watching and not daring to join in. The V8 has the same hull as the X18.

Ian Smith - 11 years ago

Stop looking at videos and try both...then you will know

Ian Smith - 11 years ago

Dismissing the Epic as a no rocker kayak is annoying too. Check its lines..it has rocker enough to handle big conditions. I am a boat designer. I can find no real reason for the long overhangs on old style sea kayaks except for beaching on ice. Over the last 2 years I have introduced sea kayakers to the Epic and the wing paddles. They have all converted. I was also a lover of the old classic look and kept my old kayaks for some time, before realising they will not be my go to kayaks anymore.

Ian Smith - 11 years ago

I have paddled the Epic without the rudder and it handle at least as well as any Valley, Rockpool, P&H, Tiderace etc that I have paddled. With the rudder it handles even better. So many defensive comments on here by people who obviously have not paddled the Epic. My experience of 30 years paddling so called traditional designs and 2 years paddling the Epic is that the Epic performs better in almost all conditions with perhaps the exception tight rock hopping. But even then it works.

Ian Smith - 11 years ago

The Epic 18x does have rocker and handles big conditions well. Looking through post on here, people are being too black & white on this.

Jemmaa Johnson - 12 years ago

Wow that's cool...

Ian Smith - 12 years ago

18x vs Romany? Comparing the 2 extremes in a single situation? They are essentially design for different purposes. I have an Epic and love they way if performs - speed and efficient open water paddling in all conditions. It will out perform a highly rockered kayak on a journey into the wind and waves or running with a following sea. However if my aim is to rock hop, or simply play in the rough stuff in any angle to the waves then something like the Romany would be my choice.

20. comment for Epic Kayaks - Rough Water Comparison

Vick Vapor - 12 years ago

Looks like a bunch of grumpy old men commented on this vid.

zerascal3 - 12 years ago

Comparing two different rocker line. Big fucking deal. Compare turning ability and resistance to broaching while surfing next and we'll see which come first. Beside, if you worry about splashes, what are you doing at sea. Lol...

Gary Grzybek - 13 years ago

Two different animals. Nothing against Epic but if your not racing or always worried about speed then the traditional designs can be more playful. It's all about what you want out of a particular design.

Kuviasuktok - 13 years ago

I think I'll sell my Nordkapp and upgrade to an Epic kayak dws

Gastón Gonzalez - 13 years ago

sea kayak ♥

sw3210 - 14 years ago

@1a2b3d cheers. the truth is out there

sw3210 - 14 years ago

this vid concerns me, and fails to really explore the topic. the classic sea kayak was designed for good reason. look into it before posting something that is giving less than half of the story...shame on you. the rocker versus no rocker debate is old hat. its horses for courses...the paddler needs to assess their needs, and conditions, and find a compremise that will suit most situations. this crap is just giving false information.

Alex McGruer - 15 years ago

Epic is a fast boat. Lets throw wind waves on top or swell and maneuver that thing through rocks to a take out. Not what or who is it made for..? Have a moderately skilled paddler work with a quartering or beam wind! Rocker is there for a reason and as most club type paddles are 10 - 15 miles at moderate to slow speed being able to turn trumps speed. Dissing other boats just annoys most of us.

ladedk - 15 years ago

All the splashing is fun dammit!!! i like it alot. makes me feel all macho and extreme....

seahog32 - 15 years ago

and don't get me wrong, i'm not trying to play advocate for any of those too camps, i love both traditonal boats and the surf skis, but if you want to see how surf skis (low rocker boats) slam water when paddling honestly hard then watch this: watch?v=eFotgG_1R8c i just hate this kind of false advertisement

30. comment for Epic Kayaks - Rough Water Comparison

seahog32 - 15 years ago

this is rather ridiculous, those guys are trying really hard to prove stated by tweaking their paddling and even then it does not work all the time that convincingly... ...and it seems to be obvious that less rocker/longer waterline should translate into a faster hull while a pronounced rocker, especially combined with hard chines should excel in maneuverability but even that is not quite true...just look at the hull of a modern sprint K1

mr1scotty - 15 years ago

For all the people complaining about small waves see 'rough water comparison 2 larger waves' Probably still not big enough for some. The small amount of rocker only causes a problem in big steep following seas where the rudder is high and dry and the boat likes to swop ends.

Alex Larson - 15 years ago

well, it isn't that unsafe.

Alex Larson - 15 years ago

The pitching up and down is what makes sea kayaking fun. BTW- the upturned bow of the rockered sea kayak will cut through large waves better. Please stop this bashing.

SeadartVSG - 16 years ago

This is not exactly rough water. These are Gentle swells and the paddler is exaggerating the weighting to make the bow lift and splash. Standing waves in a tide race or rebounding waves from cliffs and I much prefer a boat with some rocker.

Karl Geisel - 16 years ago

My first sea kayak had no rocker to it... I'll tell you what, I'd rather go "bobbing over a wave" then trying to paddle thru it any day. If all you paddle in is .5 meter swells, then having no rocker will probably be OK, but put yourself in real, rough water and you'll want the boat with at least a bit of rocker to it!

Keith Wikle - 16 years ago

Not sure how that is relevant. Notice how the paddler of the romany stopped paddling at a critical moment before going over the swell. That has a lot to do with keeping pressure on the bow over the wave.

captaintanuki - 16 years ago

For all the critics of Epic please bear in mind the fact that Freya Hoffmeister is paddling an Epic kayak around Australia.

PaddleDogC5 - 8 years ago

what did they give her? The first Epic failed and had to be replaced.

pinkandgeek - 16 years ago

I agree, that isn't rough water. The Epic has NO rocker, the other boat has rocker. There is nothing revolutionary about a boat with little or no rocker.